And the joke continues...

[Dr Dan Stantz]

The NHL seriously needs to get their shit together in regards to the All-Star Game.

Letting fans vote as much as they do right now is fucking insane. People can vote up to hundreds of times in a day if they have unlimited texting plans, and that has resulted in so many players being announced as starters that don't deserve to even be in the game.

East:
F - Crosby
F - Malkin
F - Kovalev (fuckin seriously?)
D - Markov (maybe 2 years ago)
D - Komasarik (apparently you can be injured for a long time and still earn a starting spot... more on this later)
G - Price (ok, fine)

Fuckin Habs fans... its ridiculous. They almost had all 6 at one point. Its a fuckin farce. And since the NHL has their "rule" about every team getting a representative, having 4 Habs already on the starters robs real All-Stars of their spots.

West:
F - Toews
F - Kane
F - Getzlaf
D - Campbell
D - Niedermayer
G - Giguere

Ok, again its only from 2 teams, but at least people can make a case for all of these guys.

Then today, the Western reserves were announced... oh boy... here we go with the ridiculousness.

G - Luongo (see Komasarik)
G - Backstrom

D - Boyle
D - Lidstrom
D - Weber
D - Souray

F - Thornton
F - Iginla
F - Nash
F - Datsyuk
F - Hejduk (really? not sure about this one)
F - Modano (WHAT?)
F - Doan
F - Dustin Brown (yea, I had to include his first name cuz most people don't know he's the captain of the Kings)
F - Tkachuk (WHAT?)
F - Smyth (what?)

Tkachuk? Modano? Smyth?

This just in... rather than showcasing the Young Stars game before the skills competition, this year we're having the Old Farts game. Gotta be kidding me.

How is Marian Hossa not in this game? Patrick Sharp? Fucking Patrick Marleau has 42 points. Daniel Sedin? Brad Boyes? ALL of these guys are deserving of All-Star bids. I don't care about every team having a player in the game. Dustin Brown has 26 points. He should not be in this game. Pathetic. Seriously, what was their criteria here? For the love of God, Jeremy Roenick probably had consideration for this game based on his "status" (that's right, I just made fun of Roenick, take note, it won't happen again for a long time).

I can't wait for the Eastern reserves to be announced tomorrow. With the rate they're going, I'd be willing to bet Carter, yea the guy tied for the lead in goals, nah he won't make it. We gotta bring Bill Guerin along from the Islanders for the Old Farts game.

[vance]

The problem lies within the system.

1) Letting fans vote the starters. You get 3 Ducks, 3 Hawks. Maybe 2 of which are deserving
2) Each team must be represented by atleast 1 player.

So we take away 4 of those starters, as well as representatives of the Kings, Avalanche, Stars, Coyotes, Blues, and Oilers (all of whom don't deserve players on an all-star team) and there opens up 8-10 spots (since obviously Kane/Toews would still be chosen) for players who deserve it.

How does Steve Mason not get a spot on the team (even though he'll undoubtably replace Luongo since he's hurt)? What about Hossa, Nabokov, Phaneuf, M. Koivu, Marleau, hell even Devin Setoguchi?

It's a shame that 2 arbitrary rules fuck up something that should be a showcase.

[el_duderino]

It's amazing how the least watched (or at least most mocked) all-star game of the major 4 sports has the best selection process for the rosters. The NFL uses the fan vote as 1/3 of the weight for the starters, and the rest of the weight is from the votes of players and coaches.

(For the record, any system that involves a vote by any group of people [be it from those on the inside, outside, or a combination of the two] will have flaws for the lone reason that there will always be a difference in opinion to the level of "what makes a good player". Even making a system that would pick automatically based upon certain criteria would have this flaw in the selection process as well. But I digress...)

With the NFL's selection process, you have the focus that the game is still a showcase for the fans - your paying customer. Giving them input as to who they want to see in their showcase is just good business. However, adding in the coaches and players helps balance things out. Again, not perfect, but it cuts down on the fans flooding the ballots. Point in case, the fans voted 17 Redskins to the Pro-Bowl; after the players/coaches vote, only 4 are on the team. At least at some level, sanity and reason takes over.

Let's not forget that they have the largest roster size (26 starers and 16 reserves per conference), yet they DO NOT have the equal representation rule. If you can't find a player worthy of making the team, they don't make the team.

Yes, every year there will always be claims of those who don't deserve and those who were snubbed. It's bound to happen in any voting system. But there are at least ways to keep these grumblings to a dull roar.

[mooseontheloose]

Yes its true that any system will have its flaws. Still when you have a starting line up with four of the six from one team and these do not include league leaders in goals, plus/minus, GAA, etc something is most definitely wrong. Certainly include fan voting, it is nice to give the fans a say, but lets put some kind of criteria limit here...

Crosby and Malkin...point leaders, makes sense. Kovalev? Gotta scroll down a little to find his points compared to an abundance of many more qualified selections.

Yes, I know its crazy, but I am thinking that what makes a player an All-Star is the fact that he actually produces for his team at a higher rate than most in the league. The players that fans can vote for need to be limited in some fashion by stats. Perhaps taking point leaders, plus/minus leaders, GAA leaders and creating some kind of cut off. If so and so isn't here or above on the list, not eligible. Obviously this would make some players eligible one day, then ineligible the next. The best of the best would be eligible for votes more days than the rest Complex? Maybe, but at least if you saw a lot of players from one team on the starting line up, it would be because they are all performing.

[Dr Dan Stantz]

Interesting concept Moose. In fact, I like it a lot.

I'd definitely like to see some sort of weighted system applied though. The NFL's version sounds great to me, or at least an excellent starting point.

Absolutely, though, without doubt, they need to remove the "every team gets a representative" shit. I don't know what the thought process is here... "If Team A doesn't have a rep, than that teams fans won't watch and we'll lose viewers!" News for ya, Bettman... If Team A doesn't have a guy who's legitimately good enough to be in the All-Star game, chances are Team A doesn't have that many viewers to begin with.

[Dr Dan Stantz]

Ok, now for the joke of the East...

G - Thomas
G - Lundqvist

D - Bouwmeester
D - Streit
D - Kaberle
D - Chara

F - Carter
F - Heatley
F - Kovalchuk
F - Lecavalier
F - Ovechkin
F - Parise
F - Savard
F - Staal
F - Vanek

I really can't complain too much about the forwards. These are pretty good. Only one really that should be replaced is Elias for Staal. Elias is tied for 8th in the league in points, how is he not an All-Star?

And I'm sorry, but how is Kimmo Timonen not in this game? He is one of the top 3 defenders in the conference EASILY, some nights he IS the best. That's the biggest one that pisses me off here. The defenders added here are all great players, but Timonen needed to be in this game. That's just wrong.

Oh, and btw... 8 of the top 20 scorers in the NHL are NOT in the All-Star Game. That's impressive.

Overall, I'm gonna say that the Western All-Stars are a much bigger joke than the East. I'm definitely bettin on the East for this game, but damn... so many mistakes.

[el_duderino]

The day we get a "mistake-free" all-star game lineup for any sport is the day sports in America end. ESPN will (hopefully) implode, and we will be relegated to watching things like this:

I, for one, accept our new crazy, Czech singing overlords.

[phillyfiend]

WHAT THE HELL. That was just freaky!

[mooseontheloose]

A. Could not agree more about Timonen. He definitely needs to be in this game.

B. Goaltending selections are good.

C. Too much down time at the office Grady?

[el_duderino]

Jan 12, 2009 19:18:31 GMT -5 mooseontheloose said:

A. Could not agree more about Timonen. He definitely needs to be in this game.

B. Goaltending selections are good.

C. Too much down time at the office Grady?

Perhaps, but thankfully I have other people who find these gems for me, leaving me to waste my time in more productive ways. Like making Maurice Evans pot smoking jokes, or trying to set "new goals" in my third season of Fantasy Golf.

Yeah...I lead an exciting life. ;D